Welcome, Guest
Username: Password: Remember me
BARGES: All about barges and barging - building, buying, maintaining, equipment, handling on the water, etc.
  • Page:
  • 1
  • 2

TOPIC: ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate??

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? Yesterday 18:44 #102462

Well done Simon, worth sticking with it. It'll take five years of leisurely barging to grow back the hair that you lost in the process.
Perhaps overlooked is that you have set a strong precedence possibly for others to take strength from.
Paul Hayes
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? Yesterday 11:55 #102460

Hooray!

It only takes one bureaucrat who doesn't know the rules to create confusion.

Pete
The following user(s) said Thank You: Sam Archer, simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Pete Milne, Quo Vadis, Europe

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? Yesterday 11:22 #102459

AT looooong last my barge has been issued with an ENI number.

Having contacted the RYA (the MCA's ENI issuing authority) who have still not come back to me with any sort of help other than saying NO they cant help as its a foreign registered ship! (3 weeks waiting) So I dropped a simple email to the Belgium authorities requesting an ENI number-even though I had been informed by the same authorities that under no circumstances would they issue an ENI number to a non Belgium citizen.
They emailed me back within 24hrs with the ENI number for the barge!

The long saga of obtaining ALL of the necessary paperwork to be able to cruise legally on the continent is finally over-until Brexit-then who knows!

Thanks to everyone in the DBA for their advice, help, information, PM's and support without which I would have never have purchased the barge, moved it 1600km found a winter mooring and got the paperwork all sorted!

Cheers everyone.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 03 Nov 2018 13:52 #102236

simon wrote: Can I make a suggestion to who ever can update the Knowledge base-please insert an explanation what an ENI number is and its implications? Anyone else researching barges would find it useful information.


Done! Under Regulations / The Boat

Pete

Suggestions for correction or update to This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. please.
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Pete Milne, Quo Vadis, Europe

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 03 Nov 2018 10:20 #102235

simon wrote: Thanks for the input Simon, Tam and Andy-I have sent an email to the Belgium authorities requesting an ENI number-it might be that the CBB surveyors were wrong-which looking at the directive they are, if they still won't issue one then I will quote the directive and see where that gets me.

I am still waiting for the RYA to come back to me-and as Tam and others have said if they issued numbers to foreign vessels in the past then they should do so now!


Your second para - RYA - As far as I know the foreign built vessels, like mine, were UK registered at the time - and that is the MCA instruction that they should be working to.
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Best Wishes
Andy Soper
DBA Director
mv Neeltje
Coookham
0044 (0) 303 666 0636

You don't need a barge to join - a dream of boating in Europe will do'. See www.barges.org

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 03 Nov 2018 10:06 #102234

Thanks for the input Simon, Tam and Andy-I have sent an email to the Belgium authorities requesting an ENI number-it might be that the CBB surveyors were wrong-which looking at the directive they are, if they still won't issue one then I will quote the directive and see where that gets me.

I am still waiting for the RYA to come back to me-and as Tam and others have said if they issued numbers to foreign vessels in the past then they should do so now!

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 02 Nov 2018 19:48 #102232

It was certainly simple enough when the RYA was first appointed to issue ENI numbers May/June 2011 so ships could get their TRIWV certification , and several owners with UK registered vessels vied to get the lowest numbers - Friesland is 140 00008 but I can't now remember who has 00001. I can't imagine why the RYA should be at all confused now, 7 years later.

Tam

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 02 Nov 2018 19:36 #102231

Directive 2016/1629 Article 18

Unique European vessel identification number

1. Member States shall ensure that each craft is assigned a unique European vessel identification number (ENI), in accordance with Annexes II and V.
2. Each craft shall have only one ENI, which shall remain unchanged during its entire lifetime.
3. When issuing a Union inland navigation certificate, the competent authority shall include the ENI therein.
4. Each Member State shall draw up a list indicating the competent authorities responsible for assigning ENIs and shall notify the Commission thereof, as well as any changes to the list. The Commission shall maintain an up-to-date list of competent authorities on an appropriate website.

It is open for discussion as to which member state issues. the ENI. We pressured MCA into appointing a UK number issuer for UK ships to address the reluctance of some nations to issue numbers to non-residents.

UK derogated its waters - not ships - hence the need for UK 140 numbers.

The number is attached to the ship - not the owner..
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Best Wishes
Andy Soper
DBA Director
mv Neeltje
Coookham
0044 (0) 303 666 0636

You don't need a barge to join - a dream of boating in Europe will do'. See www.barges.org

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 02 Nov 2018 17:41 #102230

Hi Simon,

Thats interesting that the RYA said that. No one in the UK can issue the certificates, so therefore you'd think the RYA wouldn't have issued any ENI numbers. We got one last year (British Ship, resident over here) but the certificate was issued by Register Holland.

Hope you can find a solution, it does seem to me that Belgium should issue it if the ship is registered with them.

Thanks,

Simon
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 01 Nov 2018 19:39 #102222

Hi Pete

Having spoken with the RYA again today they had revisited the articles for the ENI and as I had also read them it does state that the country issuing the CBB/TRIWV certificate are also the ones to issue the ENI number, so I shall be contacting the Belgium authorities tomorrow again and asking them to issue one!
And as you say-its immaterial who owns the boat as the number is for the boat!

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 01 Nov 2018 19:30 #102221

Good point Simon. I suspect that most of us will have simply been assigned an ENI with issue of the Community Certificate and instructed where to put it on the boat, so it has never been too interesting - until your experience. I will get an article on the KB.

I've not heard of any other member being refused an ENI on grounds of nationality so I think whoever told you that was talking nonsense. The number isn't even related to the 'nationality' of the boat, since it remains on the boat for its lifetime.

Incidentally, for everyone, PLEASE email This email address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it. with any suggestions for addition or change to the knowledgebase. It is continually evolving, often from comments on the Forum, but it needs YOUR knowledge to keep it uptodate. DBA doesn't have a huge team of researchers to maintain it!

Pete
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Pete Milne, Quo Vadis, Europe

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 01 Nov 2018 19:07 #102219

Simon,

As the DBA's new found expert on ENIs, perhaps you could write a few paragraphs on ENIs and then the KB editor will incorporate your pearls of wisdom.
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Colin Stone
KEI
www.luxe-motor.kei.co.uk

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 01 Nov 2018 18:28 #102217

Can I make a suggestion to who ever can update the Knowledge base-please insert an explanation what an ENI number is and its implications? Anyone else researching barges would find it useful information.

When I was doing my research before buying a barge the knowledgeable section was very helpful indeed-but I never found anywhere the mention of an ENI number!

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 29 Oct 2018 18:04 #102148

And the saga goes on and on...........................

Had an eamil back with the application form from the RYA for the ENI number-and I just knew it-they cant issue it as its registered in Belgium, they can only issue to a UK registered boat, the Belgiums canbt issue one as Im not a Belgium resident-so come on guys where do I go from here-this is all i=I need now to get my Community certificate!

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 25 Oct 2018 14:12 #102087

Pete

Since I like formula's. I tried to look up the one to get an ENI number, and to my surprise I see in the wikipedia article that aso Austrlia and the USA have a EIN prefix! where the hell would you get one in either of these 2? lol

Please Log in to join the conversation.

www.jan-kees.us
jan-kees.blog

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 25 Oct 2018 10:08 #102080

The Netherlands have a formula for calculating the ENI, as I and others have described BUT there is no know equivalent for other countries, notably Belgium, which is under question here.
I think whoever told Simon that they would not issue an ENI because he isn't Belgian is wrong. I'll talk to my Belgian friends (on a 29m Tjalk).

Pete
The following user(s) said Thank You: simon

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Pete Milne, Quo Vadis, Europe

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 25 Oct 2018 09:21 #102079

We had our first TRIWV in 2010 - along with NL AIS grant. Peter Voerman asked if I had an ENI, I didn't know of one.
He checked the NL kadaster and found the hull had been allocated one automatically.
Our hull number is 2004 BR 25625 - year, Breda and number. Our ENI is 02325625.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

Colin Stone
KEI
www.luxe-motor.kei.co.uk

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 25 Oct 2018 08:13 #102076

We went through all this in the NL, the ship has an ENI and you don't need to have it issued. It is the country code with a 0 in front then the ships number with a 0 in front if only three digits as Pete said. Ours is Den Hagg (where the ship is registered, 301) so 0301 followed by the ships number as per the registration, in our case 366, so 0 in front and you get 0366. So 03010366. In the end we worked it out with help from others, I then asked the authorities to confirm the number and they did. The number belongs to the ship and has nothing to do with who owns it.

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 25 Oct 2018 06:44 #102074

Andy Soper wrote:
UK is 14 but most older ships will have had an NL number allocated against a Kadaster entry - a Dutch surveyor can advise.


Andy my ship has not ever had an ENI number given to it and the ship is on the Belgium register in my name now-will the UK issue me with an ENI number as it’s a Belgium register ship? The Belgium authorities said they wouldn’t issue the ENI number as I’m not a Belgium citizen!

Please Log in to join the conversation.

ENI-ESTRIN-community certificate?? 24 Oct 2018 23:20 #102073

Posted to soon.
When in 2011 it became necessary to obtain the triwv we were told that before it could be issued we needed the ENI number and I seem to recall that it was some time before the Rya could start to issue them. We were number 10.
No mention was made that other countries could issue us a number or that old ditch numbers could be used. Peke has AM and also ROTT and BE numbers punched into the hull .

Please Log in to join the conversation.

  • Page:
  • 1
  • 2
Moderators: Pete Milne
Time to create page: 0.238 seconds