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Navigating and living on the waterways of Continental Europe and news of canal developments.
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TOPIC: Air draft of 3.7mtrs

Air draft of 3.7mtrs 21 Aug 2019 23:24 #108907

There are also a,lot of places on the continent that you can go with your Carver than you may not be able to get to with a more inland waters focused boat. I would suggest finishing up with cruising the Baltic and NL first before you downsize your boat. I think the biggest issue you have are thwe,size of those engine's. But big engines are exactly what you want to make tbose sea crossiings within a weather window.

Also post Brexit it may be important to be able,to get your boat back to thw UK regularly to avoid vat issues.

Dont give up on yoir currwnt boat yet.

Tim

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 21 Aug 2019 10:42 #108900

People are always constrained to a greater or lesser extent by the vessel they have as to where they cruise and the sort of boating they do. Some blunder into continental cruising and blunder back out again after a year or so - they've "done" canals and look for something else; some are hooked but decide to buy a different craft. But most stay for rather longer and totally enjoy the life they have within those constraints.

Tam
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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 21 Aug 2019 10:37 #108899

that's right, Best is 3.4M, especially the last (water) bridge by Roanne and Briare port is verry scary

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res non verba,
Tx for the beer :-)

Air draft of 3.7mtrs 21 Aug 2019 10:30 #108898

I reckon I am 3.35m and quite a few freycinet bridges are pretty tight. I have on a few occasions gone to full ahead when wheelhouse is 3-4m from the bridge structure to drop the stern and reduce airdraft to get under.

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Colin Stone
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DBA - De Binnenvaartvereniging
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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 21 Aug 2019 10:12 #108897

  • Peter Cawson
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> I am resigned to removing everything else off the wheelhouse roof, but only if it has to go. That includes 6 solar panels, 3 VHF aerials, GPS aerial, klaxon, nav lights - and did I forget anything else?

Holland's a great country and you can keep all that stuff in place! Try it for a year or two.

Peter

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 20 Aug 2019 23:07 #108893

Hello Alan
Right now I'm at St Valery sur Somme, with very little experience of the French system as yet. But I do believe that my current 3.7m won't get me far. But I do plan to remove a TV dome and a searchlight, which |I| think will get me down to a tad under 3.5m. If you have access to PC Navigo, you will be able to see where you will run into problems, and by how much, for any route you choose. In my case, I am resigned to removing everything else off the wheelhouse roof, but only if it has to go. That includes 6 solar panels, 3 VHF aerials, GPS aerial, klaxon, nav lights - and did I forget anything else? But I am putting that decision off while I do more important works.

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 19 Aug 2019 12:43 #108841

  • Peter Cawson
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> I'm on Hayling right next to Portsmouth Peter and keep my boat at Hayling Yacht Company .

Your mooring fees in NL will be less than those at HYC, even though you'll be paying daily while cruising and weekly / monthly / 6-monthly when not cruising.

Peter

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 18:30 #108804

  • Alan Harbutt
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I'm on Hayling right next to Portsmouth Peter and keep my boat at Hayling Yacht Company .
You guys are a mine of information!

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 18:19 #108802

There was a time I looked at a boat with 2 engines, but that wasn't the reason it didn't happen. No one mentioned what I figured out - turn off the canal-side engine before coming abreast. Just because you have 2 doesn't mean you always have to use both - as someone pointed out from a redundancy perspective. I thought at the time that the ease of handling and redundancy issue outweighed the turning the canal side engine off issue.
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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 17:53 #108801

  • Peter Cawson
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> We are in the UK on the south coast,

Me too (in Portsmouth) until I return to France next month. PM me if you'd like to meet up for a drink and chat.

Peter

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 17:37 #108799

  • Peter Cawson
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I'd agree with Balliol. NL and Belgium should be your first venture onto inland waterways where your present boat would fit in very well.

Costs of cruising in NL and France rather depends on how many weeks per year you cruise and whether you prefer to stop in marinas, town moorings, or at remote spots. France has a significant license (about €5-600 per year) but you can normally find mooring places that are free apart from marinas. Marinas are less costly (by about 25-30% I reckon) than NL. In fact you can cruise much of France totally free of mooring fees if you are independent of shore power. In NL you'll normally find someone to collect fees from just about everywhere you moor in urban areas such as town and village moorings. In Friesland you can buy a Marrekrite flag that entitles you to use of thousands of free pontoon moorings, but they are all in remote spots, often without access even to the shore. Biggest bargain in boating though! And of course you can simply drop anchor in any of the large lakes.. Overall, the cost of license plus mooring dues may be much the same in France and NL. Certainly don't be put off NL because of higher mooring costs.

Getting repair work done in France is a nightmare. If you know your boat backwards and are a dab hand with all sorts of repair jobs that may need doing and carry a comprehensive tool box and crate of spares, France can present no problems. In NL, every village will have an experienced boat mechanic / electrician who will be able to fix most things - and he'll speak English which is a massive advantage compared with France if you don't speak much French.

Peter

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 12:23 #108785

  • Balliol Fowden
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Personally I would be perfectly happy just basing ourselves on the waterways of Belgium and Holland, particularly given that with a properly seagoing boat one could also venture into the Baltic etc.

With an air draft of 3.7 metres most NL waterways are open to you, and I am struggling to think of a Belgian waterway where you would have a problem.

Twin screws? It perhaps depends how wide-spaced and/or how well protected they are. NL will not be a problem. They could be an issue on the smallest Belgian waterways, but as I recall a GB has a good deadwood so probably OK with care.

In terms of costs I cannot be specific since I keep no records and take little notice, but my impressions would be (in respect of boating costs, not costs of living) that Belgium and NL are probably cheaper overall. French mooring facilities are more limited and seem more expensive because there is less competition. Yard costs tend to be much higher in France for the same reason (and in some cases yards are much less competent). The French Vignette is a significant annual cost whereas there is no equivalent in NL or French speaking Belgium, and the Flemish Vignette is nominal at the moment.

Balliol.

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 11:52 #108782

  • Alan Harbutt
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Hi Jan.
We are in the UK on the south coast, we have taken her to France and the channel islands a few times but rather fancy cruising the inland waterways as getting fed up with coastal weather restrictions and the finances of keeping her here in marinas!
Alan

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 11:44 #108781

  • Alan Harbutt
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Hi Steve, thanks for your reply.
It is interesting to hear of your experiences with your GB. I love the maneuverability of twin props and can put my carver anywhere with just a few inches to spare.
My major concern is that we have owned my Carver for about 15 years and spent a fortune on modernizing and maintaining her, I know I won't get even a fraction of that money back when I sell her and the possibility of having to start again when buying another boat just scares me!
So lots to consider over the next year or so!

Alan

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 11:35 #108779

  • Alan Harbutt
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Hi Peter
Many thanks for your reply and info!
It wasn't an area we were thinking of but may now consider it. Funds will be rather short when we retire so France was our first thought as we had been told it was cheaper there.

Alan

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 11:26 #108776

  • Alan Harbutt
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Hi Tam
North Europe could be an idea to test the waters and see if we like canal cruising, I think may look into that!
Do you know if it's anymore expensive than the French ones? Like mooring fees for leaving the boat for long periods etc.
Alan

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 10:31 #108769

Amazingly, we have been travelling France in a two engined boat for four years and find the advantages (manoeuvrability and having a spare engine in case of breakdown [as we are currently doing]() completely outweigh the disadvantages. We cannot wait for our port diesel leak to be repaired so that we can be two engined again.


I fully support this!

our previous boat was a G.B. 42, with 2x 120HP.

With this we have sailed for 7 years, always 6 months a year, almost every French channel.
the benefits of a Twin are enormous, you have absolutely no trouble with your propeller direction, you sail perfectly straight and back, enormous maneuverability, you do not need a bow thruster and yes, you can sail on strong rivers and at sea, that is quite a lot!

let the engines run 800 to 900rpm and let them go well on the rivers

boats with really heavy engines are idd. unsuitable, their powers are much too great for this purpose and then sail very badly and with difficulty

the only drawback is that you really have to stay away from the side and see if there is sufficient depth when mooring the ship.
the french borders are very shallow on the sides

no, you have more advantages than disadvantages, especially if they are only for vacations
test it all out yourself, and draw your conclusions, but note the headroom, which is OK for 3.5m, better is 3.40, because some bridges have sunk a bit over the years, also thanks to the heavy freight traffic

An additional advantage is that you can lie down everywhere, many mooring places and marinas are limited to 15 / 16M

we sold that ship because we deliberately sailed on quieter water and started living on it, something we didn't spend a sec on. regret it.
with nostalgia I think back to a ship with 2 engines !!!

keep on sailing like this and experience the canals with a twin, in luxury, like an emperor with a horse carriage of 6 horses

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res non verba,
Tx for the beer :-)

Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 07:57 #108759

Peter Cawson wrote: Hi Alan and welcome to the forum.

Your twin engines are not really suitable on any inland waterways

I agree with Tam that in France your twin props will be a handicap and you'll have to be doubly careful when close to banks.

...and live with the minor disadvantages of twin engines.

Peter


Amazingly, we have been travelling France in a two engined boat for four years and find the advantages (manoeuvrability and having a spare engine in case of breakdown [as we are currently doing]() completely outweigh the disadvantages. We cannot wait for our port diesel leak to be repaired so that we can be two engined again.

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 18 Aug 2019 07:45 #108758

Alan , where is your Craver located ...in Europe? These carvers are great boats, but they are fro the Ohio River, the ICW etc. that much power is never needed on the canals, and often the speed on the canals means engines close at idle.

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Air draft of 3.7mtrs 17 Aug 2019 18:28 #108754

  • Peter Cawson
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Hi Alan and welcome to the forum.

Personally I keep it for at least a year and spend that time in the Netherlands with excursions into Belgium and maybe Germany, where bridges open for you and air draft is not a problem. Your twin engines are not really suitable on any inland waterways (unless you plan to travel the Rhine upstream!), but much less of a problem in NL with many very large lakes, some with high speed limits.

Your draft of 1.07 is not a problem in France . If rivers or canal water levels are very low (as several are right now) these waterways will be closed to all traffic before you'll have a problem. I agree with Tam that in France your twin props will be a handicap and you'll have to be doubly careful when close to banks.

So, don't rush to sell, spend a year in NL - you may well stay several years - and live with the minor disadvantages of twin engines. Sell before attempting to venture into France where you won't get beyond the first bridge!

Peter

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