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BARGES: All about barges and barging - building, buying, maintaining, equipment, handling on the water, etc.
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TOPIC: Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole

Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 23:02 #115684

  • Jakob Schröter
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My mooring is on a floating pontoon where the dolphins are not the strongest. My main motivation for reinstalling the spud pole is to take some load off the dolphins in the heaviest of weather.
This is in a cul-de-sac river arm 100m or so from the canalized river with commercial traffic, so there is little/no wash but some alternating surge/current going past the mooring.

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 22:28 #115683

Jakob

I can't help feeling the need to ask why you want a spud leg. It will be hugely expensive to install one that is bigger than the existing installation allows, and (in my view) it's in the wrong place if you want it to hold station while waiting for locks or bridges for the reason I gave earlier - unless you also have a stern thruster.

You will very rarely need a spud for a longer stay - at a mooring with no suitable shore-side posts, or perhaps impossible to land. Generally speaking, you can always find somewhere to tie up conventionally with lines and perhaps with the help of 2 or 3 of stout pins and a club hammer.

If your prime motive is to occasionally hold station, then perhaps less costly and certainly far more useful would be efficient bow and stern thrusters.

My boat is similar to yours in length and weight (15 x 4.5 m and 22 tons) and, although I've occasionally thought "wouldn't it be nice to have a pin anchor", I wouldn't dream of installing one in such a boat. I do have bow and stern thrusters, although as more vessel handling experience is gained, these are used far less often than when I started boating. However, they are essential equipment in my view.

Peter

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 19:45 #115681

  • Jakob Schröter
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Hi all,

Thank you for the valuable information. I will reconsider my plans.

I do not know why pole and winch were removed. The boat was considerably lighter (basically an open tub) before I converted her so that the relatively thin pole may have been sufficient at the time.

What would be a suitably sized spud leg for a converted barge that size (14x3.6)? I would guesstimate her displacement somewhere between 15 and 20 tons.

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 17:22 #115680

  • Steve Van de Pas
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p.s. mourning the channels here are so shallow that the thickest tube extends only 1 / 2m and then 1 / 2m into the mud

even on a fast-moving cargo ship, the ship does not move a fin, while most of the water is sucked away

one of my best investments ever made, everything works automatic or semi auto

don't forget the inner rubber rings against the clatter of the tubes at night

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res non verba,
Tx for the beer :-)

Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 17:21 #115679

  • Balliol Fowden
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Derek and Janice Wallace wrote: "if you are happy with the framework installed " I think covers my point ! Extra bracing may be required and relatively easy to do.
I was offering a cost effective solution to beef up the pole ! <

Sorry Derek, no offence intended. I was just highlighting and embroidering what you had hinted at. As always when invited to comment, it would be much easier if we could comment with the benefit of a photograph or two.

I often find that redundant installations such as bow rudders and spud poles have been left in place. The fact that Jakob's trunking has been left in place but no pole remains does make me wonder if it was indeed removed because it got bent?

Your own installation does sound very much more suitable and massive. Even for a relatively small barge the forces involved in terms of draw when a 2000 tonner goes past, even slowly, should not be underestimated.

Balliol.

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 17:13 #115678

  • Steve Van de Pas
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Daniel Boekel wrote: My 26 meter barge I made some telescopic spud legs also, they extend about 4 meters below the bottom.

base in ship: 406x12,5mm
outer pole: 323x12,5mm
inner pole: 244x10mm

I calculated that they can safely handle 1000 kg of side force when fully extended.

for such a small (100mm) spud hole, I've seen a smart thing: use a wooden spud leg, when that breaks, no worries, you can just pull it up. When a steel spud-leg bends...you need a very expensive diver and/ or a lift-out...

photo's of my spuds:
boekel.nu/foto/10/2010-10boot/index.htm
boekel.nu/foto/10/2010-11boot/index.htm
boekel.nu/foto/10/2010-12boot/index.htm


have the same installation, used them on steam, during storms etc.

1 tube, weighs 900KG

am really quite satisfied with it and use them a lot, also waiting for the lock and when the ship is swinging, very handy

and as with everything, use your mind

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res non verba,
Tx for the beer :-)

Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 17:01 #115677

  • Derek and Janice Wallace
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Daniel, I think you may have put the decimal point in the wrong place. It should read 10,000kg !!!

Derek

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 14:31 #115671

My 26 meter barge I made some telescopic spud legs also, they extend about 4 meters below the bottom.

base in ship: 406x12,5mm
outer pole: 323x12,5mm
inner pole: 244x10mm

I calculated that they can safely handle 1000 kg of side force when fully extended.

for such a small (100mm) spud hole, I've seen a smart thing: use a wooden spud leg, when that breaks, no worries, you can just pull it up. When a steel spud-leg bends...you need a very expensive diver and/ or a lift-out...

photo's of my spuds:
boekel.nu/foto/10/2010-10boot/index.htm
boekel.nu/foto/10/2010-11boot/index.htm
boekel.nu/foto/10/2010-12boot/index.htm
The following user(s) said Thank You: Victoria Cail, Jan Pieterse

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 13:48 #115670

  • Derek and Janice Wallace
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"if you are happy with the framework installed " I think covers my point ! Extra bracing may be required and relatively easy to do.
I was offering a cost effective solution to beef up the pole !

My own is 300 diameter 25mm thick running inside 350x350x 25 box well braced ! 29m barge.

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 12:06 #115664

  • Balliol Fowden
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Derek and Janice Wallace wrote: Hi, if you are happy with the framework installed and can on;y use the 95 tube it would be possible to stiffen and strengthen it with the addition of high yield deformed rebar and a epoxy concrete. Quite easy to do.
It would surprise most just how easy the size you quoted will bend !

Derek


..... but I would prefer to see the outer fixed trunking significantly thicker in terms of wall thickness than the spud, well reinforced and braced at the level of the top of the spud pole when deployed at maximum extent. It would also need a substantial reinforcing doubler on the shell plating at the bottom coupled with suitable internal bracing. The spud pole needs to be weaker than the trunking installation for obvious reasons! I would, by seat of the pants, want to see at least 20% of the spud length retained within the trunking, preferably rather more. Work barges with spud legs do not usually operate with the top of the spuds below weather deck level, hence the deck provides the upper bracing to the trunking.

Balliol.

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 09:34 #115661

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Hi, if you are happy with the framework installed and can on;y use the 95 tube it would be possible to stiffen and strengthen it with the addition of high yield deformed rebar and a epoxy concrete. Quite easy to do.
It would surprise most just how easy the size you quoted will bend !

Derek

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 03:06 #115660

Peter Smith wrote: Your spud sounds light however could be of use in quiet waterways and lakes. Also as a safety factor if feral's let go your lines.


Do bear in mind though that they are regarded as being equivalent to an anchor and their use is forbidden on most canals.

Tam

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 01 May 2020 03:01 #115659

Hi Jacob, my spud is similar to John's. The spud is open ended at both ends, it cuts out a plug of mud as it goes down which needs to drain out as it is raised.
The cable is mounted with a shackle at waterline when at maximum extension.
Originally there was a 150mm pulley at the top mounted with the axel on the outer rim of the sleeve which released the cable close to the centreline.
I replaced it with a winch designed for a 4x4 bumper. Weather proof, 12v and has a wireless remote. I can drop from the wheelhouse. Raising is done from much closer to enable monitoring of the raise process. The winch can raise 8000lbs and needs to be treated with caution.
Your spud sounds light however could be of use in quiet waterways and lakes. Also as a safety factor if feral's let go your lines.

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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 30 Apr 2020 13:26 #115645

> The pole itself and the winch have been removed before I acquired her,
> The pole's planned outer diameter is 95mm with 8mm walls.

Sorry I can't comment on you technical questions.

I don't want to put you off, but do you know why the previous owner removed the spud? Could it be that he was terrified at the idea of such a small diameter pole becoming bent so it couldn't be retrieved? I would be with a 95 mm diameter pole, even on a small barge.

If the boat is dead still (in relation to the bottom, not the water) it could be safely lowered, but what about wash from an inconsiderate overtaker? Or a miscalculation of the water flow, or perhaps someone doesn't fully retrieve it before you next go into a lock or shallow water? You should ensure there's a conspicuous warning devise that only stops when it's fully retracted. There's a lot that could go wrong and possible damage not only to the spud pole but the hull around the fixed tube. The smaller the diameter of both, the bigger the danger - and it's potentially a boat sinker, unless very well installed with safety devices.

I had a spud in my previous boat that was about 160 mm diameter (still too small) that was mid-ship located. If having one pole, I think this is the best location for a number of reasons, the main being you can't maintain your heading with your bow thruster if a bow pole it down. Even with this diameter, I was reluctant to use it.

Peter
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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 30 Apr 2020 12:21 #115641

  • John & Joanna Ascough
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Hi Jakob
We have two gravity deployed spud poles on the Johanna, fwd & aft. They are formed by 2 very heavy wall pipes (~15mm wall) sliding within an outer guide pipe, thus they are telescopic . The innermost pipe's top flange has a cross-bar and the inner pipe supports the outer sliding pipe, which has a internal and external flange section. A hand winch is connected by wire / rope to the cross-bar. On lowering, both tubes drop, until the outer tube hits its stop flange towards the bottom of the guide tube. The inner tube continues to drop until it hits its stop flange , which is at the lower end of the outer sliding pipe. the inner tube / spud is open and flat, minimising the risk of suction hold in mud or clay.
The poles are flush to the deck and are about 2m in length, each. When fully deployed they extend about 3.5m under the hull (not that we would use them at this extension unless the waters were very calm).
The advantage of this is a spud pole of reasonable length contained within a more restricted hull height. However, the down-side is that being gravity, they can not be driven into the ground bed, where this is permitted. We have used them to moor the 60 tonne Johanna but mainly where there is limited wash from passing boats.
Sorry, we don't have any pictures of the poles deployed, nor of the top assembly but I could do a sketch if needed.
John
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Building and retro-fitting a Spud Pole 30 Apr 2020 10:37 #115638

  • Jakob Schröter
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Hi all,

I know the spud poles topic has been discussed a lot here. I'm not looking for pro and contra but have specific questions about the building of one.

My tiny barge has had one spud pole fitted at the center line near the bow at some point in time. The pole itself and the winch have been removed before I acquired her, but the ... what's it called - the pipe that the actual pole moves up and down in - remained. It is quite short, about 1,6m, making me think the wire was attached not at the top but more towards the bottom of the pole, and it protruded above the top of the pipe when lifted up. Anyway, I don't want to go down that route and am going to extend the short pipe by 1.2m (will also double as mast base, etc.).

The pipe that's fixed in the boat has a strip of steel welded in at the bottom that decreases its diameter (does that description make sense?), presumably to prevent the pole from accidentaly sliding out, provided it has a corresponding 'thickening' at its top. Is that a common thing to do? The (few) poles I've seen did not have such 'extension' at the top.

My questions are about the construction of the actual spud pole: I understand it needs a pointed lower end. No problem there. But is that end closed or open? - I guess closed.
What about the top? - Same as bottom I guess - with venting holes near the top.
I plan to hot-dip galvanize the thing. I'm not sure whether to put epoxy paint on top of that.

How much of the pole should remain inside the pipe at its maximum extension? The barge is about 14mx3.6m. The pole's planned outer diameter is 95mm with 8mm walls. The pipe the pole runs in also has 8mm walls. It has an inner diameter of 105mm, except at the bottom where it has been narrowed to ~95ish mm.

Any advice is much appreciated.
Jakob

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