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BARGES: All about barges and barging - building, buying, maintaining, equipment, handling on the water, etc. (Public)
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TOPIC: Age matters

Age matters 30 Apr 2021 23:37 #122841

  • Chris Hanley
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I recommend asking Stefan Fritz to survey Angelus. Having surveyed her at least twice before, he probably knows the underside of that hull as well as anyone ever has.
Chris
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Age matters 29 Apr 2021 12:08 #122802

  • Hilary Morton
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Hi Chris, yes it is indeed Angelus and she's absolutely beautiful. Thank you I am just about to read your article!

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Age matters 29 Apr 2021 11:39 #122801

  • Chris Grant
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Hilary
If I'm not mistaken that's Angelus, a well known barge that belonged to a DBA founder member. She has been extensively overplated recently so the hull should be in excellent condition. She was one of the finest and oldest barges on the Thames before being sold and moved to Essex Marina.

I wrote a full article in Blue Flag 117 June 2016 about Angelus.

barges.org/publications/blue-flag/bf-back-copies/blue-flag-117-june-2016/viewdocument

Being 19.8m she does not require an E-STRIN if you should choose to take her to the continent in the future.


Hilary Morton wrote: Hi Balliol - this is the one I have been wondering about: essex.boatshed.com/dutch_barge_klipperaak-boat-276017.html

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Age matters 29 Apr 2021 10:13 #122798

  • Hilary Morton
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Hi Balliol - this is the one I have been wondering about: essex.boatshed.com/dutch_barge_klipperaak-boat-276017.html

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Age matters 28 Apr 2021 21:18 #122794

  • Balliol Fowden
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There is actually a fairly fundamental difference between two groups of barges that fall into the age ranges you are thinking of.

Basically if we are talking “old” barges, most likely but not exclusively Dutch barges, then they are likely, in the size range of say 15 to 30 metres, to have been built between lets say 1880 and 1930. These are all nominal figures and there will always be exceptions.

Still “broadly speaking,” barges built before say 1914-ish tended to be a form of iron. Those built later tend to have the basic metallurgical properties of steel, although not necessarily mild steel as we know it today.

Some people say that iron is wonderful because it doesn’t rust as much as steel, and that can be true, or sometimes might not be true. I have seen iron barges in fantastic condition corrosion-wise, because of the specific type of iron used (lowesmoor iron is one example) , and I have seen others in scary condition.

As a general rule iron has a rather lower tensile strength than steels. Iron can also sometimes be laminated, which can make satisfactory welding repairs harder. The nature of the material itself can also demand greater welding skills than steel requires. Some types of iron can also be very brittle, meaning that, even though perhaps quite thick, a sharp knock in the wrong place can crack or even shatter the metal. I have seen shatter holes big enough to get your fist through in otherwise thick iron.

So whilst there is no general rule it can be the case that pre-Great War vessels merit a different approach to those built later. There is an argument to say that they need to be of greater minimum plating thickness to compensate for the lower tensile strength, and perhaps to compensate for other factors that might make them intrinsically weaker than a post Great War ship. Due to the nature of the material they can also be very much harder to survey using modern techniques.

There are some wonderful historic iron ships about, but you need to find a good one, and personally I would be looking for a steel ship, post 1920-ish.

Balliol.
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Age matters 28 Apr 2021 20:13 #122793

  • Hilary Morton
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Reassuring, thank you

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Age matters 28 Apr 2021 19:46 #122792

  • Rob Davison
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Our recently purchased Galileo is 125 y/o this year. An out of water survey of the hull with ultrasound thickness measurements was adequate for all those concerned (insurance, etc). Assuming the boat falls into their required survey outcome parameters then age isn't something anyone was concerned with.

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Age matters 28 Apr 2021 12:18 #122783

  • Pete Milne
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Older probably, but not necessarily, means more regular TLC but if the bot is sound sound age itself is no problem. My old ladies (I'm in a period of downsizing) are 1922 and 1929. Insurance isn't an issue as that largely depends, as you should before buying, on having a good survey. Naturally an older hull may well need some plating, if it's not already been done (or maybe more if it has!). Don't skip that survey, even if the seller has one from last year!

Pete
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Pete Milne, Quo Vadis , Gent.

Age matters 28 Apr 2021 11:30 #122779

  • Hilary Morton
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Sorry if this has been covered before - I did have a look - what are people's opinions on buying a 100 odd yr old barge? How much does the age matter assuming she's insurable in the first place? Does it make more sense to look for a barge to buy that is less than a 100 yrs old, or is a 120 yr old possibly be going to as good or if not better than an 80yr old if it's been given the due care & attention required over the years? Or is a just a piece of string question? Thank yous in advance....

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